Current mapmaking situation

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  SungJ on Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:46 pm

LALA wrote:Translate the patch and I will do it

v1.170

[Megagun Zord]
-Move command rally bug fix

[Gaia]
-Ult mana : 350 -> 375

[Neiram]
-x: cooldown 2.0s -> 1.5s
-c: mana 200 -> 175
-c: starting damage 360 -> 335

[Orochi]
-Increase 10% movement speed when successfully aimed c skill
-z: mana 100 -> 75
-z: overlapping damage x5 -> x7

[Fang Dong Feng]
-ult: damage reduction 25% -> 15%
-v: starting damage 60 -> 50
-v: increasing damage per attack stat 6 -> 5

[Fobos]
-d: Increase movement speed by 2.25 -> by 1.5 + 10% add
-d: Max speed limit 9 -> 10


Last edited by SungJ on Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Alexander on Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:14 pm

I'm down for Igniz mode. I wanted this from the beginning. Maybe a mode for Zeros too. ENERGY MODE. Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

But, I think 100 gas potions regardless of even if you could carry 1/1 would be retarded. Some heroes are going to have an advantage with this over others and that's way too cheap. The whole point of potions is that it's a financial risk, now if you can buy health potions for 100 that's just silly.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  imtd on Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:08 am

Alexander wrote:I'm down for Igniz mode. I wanted this from the beginning. Maybe a mode for Zeros too. ENERGY MODE. Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

But, I think 100 gas potions regardless of even if you could carry 1/1 would be retarded. Some heroes are going to have an advantage with this over others and that's way too cheap. The whole point of potions is that it's a financial risk, now if you can buy health potions for 100 that's just silly.

Yeah to be honest if potions were lowered to 100 I would stop playing C.T.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  nc1217 on Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:09 am

Letz just make it 5v5 and ban pot.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  pacman on Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:13 am

no. lala, make your own map and call it: ct- lala land

don't mess with a good game

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Alexander on Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:43 am

100 gas potions would be interesting, but it would grow old fast after a few games because potions as a concept lose their value. It would change the metagame and dynamics to really be retarded, especially with melee.

The whole point of a potion is that it costs a significant amount early game. Because there was risk then people were more careful and you would have more mindgames. If a potion cost 100 (doesn't matter that it costs both of us 100l), there is no concern into wasting them and wasting a pot means nothing in that system, whereas I think it should mean something early game because it puts the emphasis on skill and psychology.

If you cheapen the price you cheapen value. Buying health potions at level 2 or 3 for only 100 gas drastically changes many matchups and makes it a potion game to the point where it's not about skill but rather about something retarded.

Why not then make every card in the shop cost 100? After all if it's not that big a deal to gameplay to change potions, why not cards?

I don't mind new abilities or even bringing back old ones like Genesic mode (or charge for Horus Very Happy:D:D:D:D) just for fun, but if conceptual changes like this happen I would vote to have a separate CT and choose between the two so that if we wanted to play a serious game that option still exists.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Rip on Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:35 am

Buying health potions at level 2 or 3 for only 100 gas

Why wait for that when u can buy 2mana and 1health pot from start if u're lucky with random?
Then if u're even more lucky u get sh or zava and just push ur lane in 3minutes tops (time to get to lvl3 and farm the tanks that'd make u more gas than the pot costs)
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  NoonEe on Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:23 am

I hope you are not taking this srsly, because lowering the potion cost to 100 gas is the most idiotic and ridiculous idea i have ever read in this forum. Dont touch a running system, noone complained about potion cost, and having a df kill bunker at like lvl 5 would totaly break the game.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  NoonEe on Sat Dec 03, 2011 8:40 am

I bet it would be a whole lot of fun to get potkilled and lose all 4 gastanks, then fight vs someone with 4 health pots. It would not even make mindgames totally pointless, it would also drastically lower the skilllevel, cause it wouldnt even matter if you waste 3 pots in a row.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  nc1217 on Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:01 am

Lala's idea is retarded.
Anyway can u expand the map?

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  nobeardasian on Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:10 am

EPIC REPOST BECAUSE MAYBE LALA WILL ACTUALLY READ IT AND CONSIDER IT:::

[T] Tri-Strike
-I noticed that after he uses "stim"/Tri-Strike, if he moves before the attack animation is complete, it does not do full damage. Increase the attack speed so that it is more uniform with the animation.

-Why is this spell called Tri-Strike when it only doubles the damage of his normal attack. Either change the name or actually triple the damage Razz

[Z] Deadball
- Increase 2nd attack search ball range to 7. It used to be 10 and now it is 5. a Range of 7 would allow Zedait a better way to control the lane and check towers.

-Bring back secondary damage splash, but lower the damage.

[X] Cyon Field
- Make damage equal in any position. Currently, Cyon Field only does the tool tip damage directly in the middle of the spell. The outer layer of the spell does a significant less amount of damage. Medic's "storm" attack and Soul Hunter's storm does equal damage wherever a hero is in the spell.

-Currently Cyon Field does #damage x 20. Reduce the time the spell lasts and increase the damage. At max attack, Cyon Field does 105 x 20 = 2100 damage. To increase his DPS without making the attack more powerful, 140 X 15 = 2100 damage or 175 x 12 = 2100 damage.

- Give this attack a small % of slow such as Decrease Movement Speed by 10% or so.

[C] Jade Breaker
-Increase the hit zone for Jade Breaker. Currently the hit zone is extremely small and the attack can completely miss if it is off by a small area. Possibly increase splash damage?

- Make the attack similar to Lur's Laser attack. If the projectiles fly over an object or hero, it takes damage. Doesn't have to be full damage but some.

-Make the projectiles closer together so that more projectiles can hit a single target or increase the amount of projectiles from 5 to 7 and lower the damage a little.

-Decrease cool down by 1 second for easier spam!

[F] Hellstrike
- I don't know if there was an unannounced nerf, but it feels like people have longer than 2 seconds to blink or escape from the bubble. If so, reduce the amount of time a hero has to escape from the ultimate. Many heroes including Zava, Soul Hunter, Abel, Blade Hunter, Force Fire, and more, can easily escape from Zedait's ultimate with plenty of time to react.

-As soon as Hellstrike is cast, Zedait should begin to do damage. Currently there is a 2 second delay before he starts shooting.

-If Zedait does anything during the channeling of his ultimate, the spell is cancelled automatically. I suggest that if Zedait moves, or uses another spell that his attack stops, BUT the bubble remains for the full amount of time. Currently the bubble lasts 4 seconds. I don't think it would be too big of a buff for the bubble to be used as a slow for 4 seconds considering he has no other way of slowing people.

-Reduce the amount of attacks and increase damage. Similar to Cyon Field, currently, Hellstrike does 269 x 15 = 4035. How about 404 x 10 = 4040 damage. This would allow Zedait to increase his DPS and not be forced to sit there for a long period of time and get ganked.

Miscellaneous Suggestions and Thoughts:
- New Attack! [V] It would be useful if Zedait had an attack that could create distance between himself and another hero. Similar to Dark Fact's AoE attack or Megagun's Psi-Bullet. Zedait has low HP and usually dies if is caught in close range fights.

-Increase HP?

K THANKS


also I am willing to teach you nub cakes how to play star battle like a boss lololol

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  SungJ on Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:19 am

I knew nobeard would do this lol

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  nobeardasian on Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:20 am

Check the other thread. I did it twice <3

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  NoonEe on Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:28 am

Ok, lala, your whole point seems to be that you shouldnt be behind if you miss 1-2 potkills. Think about ladder. Should every unit cost 10 minerals so youre not behind if you fail 1-2 pushes?
If you land 1-2 potkills youre ahead, therefore if you miss 1-2 you should be behind, otherwise its not a risk anymore. 100 gas healthpotions and every hero without decent burstdamage would be useless. If you want to change/add some stuff, ok. But dont turn the most core mechanic of the game upside down.

If you really want to change potions, add a new one for 175 gas that refills your mana 1 time to max; or make the refill rate for normal potions infinite cause you shouldnt be punished for fast fingers when you panicpot (my suggestions)

oh yeah, and you dont lose the game due to 1 missed pot


Last edited by NoonEe on Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Alexander on Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:34 am

LOL @ Nobeard. I too had a feeling he would do this.

@ Noone

Agree.

@ LALA

1. Why NA inhouse max ever is and will be 2 inhouses going on at the same time:

The culture in NA is linked to the culture in general. People do things here for recreation and entertainment, not competition like in Asia. Even when iDra was around this same proportion of inhouse games existed. You will never see more than 2 going on in NA unless CT surges in popularity and becomes easier to play like Hero Attack or some other garbage, but then, it will be garbage instead of a real game.

2. Why buying a pot is about the price not about the purpose:

Buying a pot is about taking a risk. I'm going to take a risk and kill you, so that the reward can be some control over the lane and slowing you down. Risk and reward. Pretty elementary concept. If the cost is lowered to 100, then you eliminate the factor of risk. The risk element makes the game rely on skill with potions. If there was no risk of loss then you are averaging the skill gaps between people and eliminating the need for mindgames and good play to succeed. CT is a game of potions, but it's also a game of prediction, anticipation and several pre-meditated considerations for a successful kill because it involves risk.

3. Why 100 gas for potions will be retarded

Starting pick bonus gives you a mana pot or health pot. Soon as you hit 5 mana you can mana pot the tanks and only need to kill one to get the money back, but some heroes like Abel will be able to kill both (you like that? Abel will be able....so pro). Heroes like Samarion who can immediately get a level advantage can start with a pot and soon as they reach 2nd level kill you outright, push lane and deny. Matchups that normally would be unfavored for a given hero are evened out because of the use of heavy health potion early to mitigate the opponent's mana pot. Sure it cost you both only 100 but again back to my point about gameplay involving skill through risk and reward.

If it's really about the action (which I agree with you on, that's the fun part in mid-game), then why not just make a version where you can start with 50 minerals and make all shop upgrades cost 1 gas for just brawling. I mean between that extreme and normalcy, making something in the middle is just not justified in reason.

TL;DR

Please make a Zeros mode and leave potions alone or give alternate map with everything messed up in it to just fuck around in. And brosky, I don't RQ after 2 pots, I RQ after 3. Get it right.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  NoonEe on Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:59 pm

LALA wrote:
you have it backward.... imagine if scv would cost 300 minerals??? thats c.t

Every single korean bunker rush zergs, lose 2 or 3 scv, 3-5 marines and one or two cancelled bunkers and they dont care and are barely behind...

Nono, dont get in that one. It would just start another discussion about sc2 game knowledge (even tho that compare was complete garbage).

I made my statement, changing potions in any way would be above retarded. I remember you saying that you dont want to really change mayor mechanics, only add new stuff. And your first idea is changing potions to 100 gas? Just get over with it, no one will support this change cause its trash, and I hope you know that too.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  SadFace on Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:25 pm

sry lala im with the bandwagon bout ur idea, i love pots and wished they were more spammable but srsly 100 means there is no risk whatsoever, u can literally use them to just push creep and still get enough gas/exp to make it worth it...

but 1 change i would really really love would be increasing the mana regen rate of pots to near infinity XD (kk whoever is gonna argue the point bout skill with pot regen timing, yea i agree but its still fuckin annoyin)

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Rip on Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:36 pm

but 1 change i would really really love would be increasing the mana regen rate of pots to near infinity XD (kk whoever is gonna argue the point bout skill with pot regen timing, yea i agree but its still fuckin annoyin)

Noway if he does that i wont be able to make u ragequit anymore >.<

And about the no ih thing it's not an argument....if they just spend their time pubstomping and dont want to ih it's simply cauz they dont have the skills or will just whine cauz ur op or some shit like that....not worth changing core mechanics for guys like that that dont want to l2p just prey on the weak...

(and for those who'll say i'm one of those pubstompers remember i do lots of ih and have loooooooooooooooooooooooooooots of time to spare so i have to pub or get bored to death >.>)
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  SungJ on Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:05 pm

Don't change anything about potions. End of story.

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Executioner on Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:35 pm

SungJ wrote:Don't change anything about normal game mechanics, or Executioner will chop your dick off. End of story.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  SungJ on Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:26 am

-.- exe why do you change what I said

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Cyclo on Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:06 am

Well SungJ, Executioner never heard of the idea if it isn't broken, don't fix it.
P.S. Executioner, what's your favorite method of execution?

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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Executioner on Mon Dec 05, 2011 6:57 am

Cyclo wrote:Well SungJ, Executioner never heard of the idea if it isn't broken, don't fix it.
P.S. Executioner, what's your favorite method of execution?
I make them read your no tl;dr post in the off-topic section. They never live to see the daylight.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  Breeze on Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:54 am

In all seriousness, Pots need to stay the same. We don't need more ITOP's, and the level of play in pubs would be shit. Most pubs i play in call me a hacker, because my "hp regenerates in battle". 100 gas pots eliminates the mystery, and gives even pub level players a gay way to escape. what stops them from just randoming, and buying 2 HP pots, and farm creep pub style? it would mess up the whole game mechanics, and Korean's wouldnt even wanna play on our server.

Sorry Artie

EDIT* what about early game? zero can blast through early game with a couple of well placed pots, and arcane's auto attacking would be nullified
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

Post  After-Life on Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:36 pm

Well in all fairness i do understand LALA's idea to make the game more fun but i have to agree with all against this. Having pots at 100 will only mean that all players will always have pots and thus making pots worthless. Just think two hero's with two pots each will always go to the hero with be most burst. I think making the game more fun is a good idea we just have to get a better way to do this.
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Re: Current mapmaking situation

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